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Post by Gopal on Jun 4, 2013 21:06:57 GMT -8
When you consider all individual then always harmony(higher harmony), when you consider a particular individual ,then may be harmony or disharmony. so higher harmony includes harmony and disharmony of each individual. Did i make it clear? Creation is always in harmony whether individual is harmony or disharmony.
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Post by Reefs on Jun 5, 2013 4:00:15 GMT -8
So 'invoked' and 'practiced' silence would be a false silence. Aha. These are the kinds of discussions that happen oh here and there that inspired the use of this bit: ...and before I even heard of you and this, it was a scream to me. Now, when, how, etc. is the 'false silence' so bad and why? I mean, there's not a lot of average joes / jills who could even tell the diff. Why is it important if nothing really matters? Life just plays out how it will............Right? If being conscientious and all that is neither here nor there, why is anything this important? False silence requires maintenance. It's hard work. It depends on what you do with your focus/attention. |
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Post by Reefs on Jun 5, 2013 4:09:03 GMT -8
As far as the aspect of "false silence" that's worth noticing, what raj said in the quote thread is a good start: it attracts it's opposite. So here you have people going to meditate, ostenchably with the intent to quiet their minds, and they just wind up eventually attracting and manifesting a bunch of mental noise. Zacklie. |
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Post by Reefs on Jun 5, 2013 4:10:59 GMT -8
Maybe instead of 'false silence' you could think of something called 'mindful eating.' Folks hear 'mindful eating' and take it to mean that one should notice their intention to reach for the fork, notice the movement of their arm and hand through space, notice the feel of the fork, the weight and the coolness of the fork, and the motion of the fork headed to the plate, and the sounds as it gently spears a cube of organic tofu, and the motion of the fork and tofu cube and arm and hand as it moves towards the opening mouth, and the first bite and release of saliva and complexity of taste, and then the second bite...and third...and swallowing and replacing fork.... Eating becomes an extremely slow activity. Nothing wrong with that, and nothing wrong with 'false silence.' It's just that it is a bit contrived. Just eat. Zackly. Someone always stays in control. |
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Post by Reefs on Jun 5, 2013 4:13:21 GMT -8
Ah, I see where you're coming from now. I like your description play-by-play of 'mindful eating'. Acshully it sounds better than either just eating (boring) and inhaling one's food - like a happy medium. Happy medium is TMT. |
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Post by Reefs on Jun 5, 2013 4:18:34 GMT -8
First there was inhaling one's food
Then there was mindful eating
then just eating.
The first is unconscious, and the details of the experience of eating are lost. The second is a practice. The third is just eating. But the third is complete with all the details of the second, and more. Some of the details are lost in the practice of the second because the practice is what is primary and not the eating.
A 'false silence' is a practice in the same way. Actual silence is polluted with the noise of the practice of 'should be silent' etc.
blah blah just riffinThat's why the approach of retracing ones steps back to silence will less likely lead to TMT than trying to become silent. If it's something new to be acquired then it's not worth it. |
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Post by silvery1 on Jun 5, 2013 7:06:35 GMT -8
Ah, I see where you're coming from now. I like your description play-by-play of 'mindful eating'. Acshully it sounds better than either just eating (boring) and inhaling one's food - like a happy medium. Happy medium is TMT. Well hey, it's only 2 words - but I do sorta get it - so I'll just knock off those 2 last words....there. I fixed it! |
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burt
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Post by burt on Jun 5, 2013 11:37:39 GMT -8
When you consider all individual then always harmony(higher harmony), when you consider a particular individual ,then may be harmony or disharmony. so higher harmony includes harmony and disharmony of each individual. Did i make it clear? Creation is always in harmony whether individual is harmony or disharmony. raj, yes! you made it clear .... as I said I was just messin' 'round .... I went back and read this and yeah, it seems to me that we got the whole "harmony of" vs. "harmony with" deal sorted out ... |
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Post by Gopal on Jun 5, 2013 21:27:03 GMT -8
hi Burt, This futility will be known if and only if overall movement of universe is running towards revealing that futility Otherwise universe get harmony with this futility as well. RAJ hi burt, Ok, If so, do you agree with me now what I meant by above quote. (This is where we started) |
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burt
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Post by burt on Jun 6, 2013 14:15:08 GMT -8
hi Burt, This futility will be known if and only if overall movement of universe is running towards revealing that futility Otherwise universe get harmony with this futility as well. RAJ hi burt, Ok, If so, do you agree with me now what I meant by above quote. (This is where we started) As a preliminary, I will state what might not need to be stated, in that our agreement or not is of little consequence. Even in disagreement, I recognize you. The first sentence is clear. This is how I interpret the second based on our conversation since then: If an individual practices they may or may not feel harmony with the Universe. |
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Post by Gopal on Jun 6, 2013 21:06:42 GMT -8
hi burt,
Yes, whether he practices or not, his harmony will be decided by overall movement of universe. And if this practices doesn't lead him to get harmony then it's not wrong, this disharmony of him is included intentionally by overall movement of universe.
RAJ
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burt
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Post by burt on Jun 7, 2013 10:37:33 GMT -8
hi burt, Yes, whether he practices or not, his harmony will be decided by overall movement of universe. And if this practices doesn't lead him to get harmony then it's not wrong, this disharmony of him is included intentionally by overall movement of universe. RAJ Yes I understand what you're saying and perceive a relevance between it and the latest quote that Reefs put up about true meditation ... your reference to intention contains a bit of a hook for me in that it implies a limitation on the unlimited, and it is in the scope of the unlimited, that I cannot express with words, in which right and wrong dissolve into one another. |
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Post by Gopal on Jun 8, 2013 1:45:22 GMT -8
hi Burt,
Can you explain me this line ' it implies a limitation on the unlimited'?
RAJ
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burt
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Post by burt on Jun 8, 2013 18:32:44 GMT -8
hi Burt, Can you explain me this line ' it implies a limitation on the unlimited'? RAJ This brings us back to the discussion of free will and choice. When you said this: this disharmony of him is included intentionally by overall movement of universe. I can find no center for this intention. Nothing that can be objectified or described. The word "Universe" points toward it, but there is nothing that can be accurately described as making choices. There is no master Choicemaker in the sky. No God. Not in any sense that is useful in this context. Looking toward this supposed individual, this mirage has no say in the matter, and can't be the source of intention. Yet, that a single outcome from more than one possible outcome is what is observed is undeniable. |
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burt
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Post by burt on Jun 9, 2013 12:29:48 GMT -8
True Silence (5)A: This is the kind of peace you get when you have learned to meditate through concentration, and you say to the teacher "Yes, I have found peace, but when I stop meditating it all goes to hell in a handbasket." This tells the teacher exactly what kind of meditation you are doing - you are controlling your experience. When you get up and go about your day and have to pay attention to other things, you cannot pay attention to your concentration, so your peace of mind disappears because it is something that is manufactured. Great way to get this distinction across. Simple, no woo-woo, no TMT, based in observation. One could say ... practical ...  . "Every instant is an opportunity". |
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