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Post by Reefs on Feb 5, 2013 2:34:19 GMT -8
I'm feeling a bit like a wild mustang at the moment reefy boy, and have you considered the possibility that I couldn't make a mistake if i tried? As long as 'mistake' is still crossing your mind, there's not only possibility for making a mistake but already some probability if you start paying attention to that thought. |
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Post by Reefs on Feb 5, 2013 2:43:38 GMT -8
I don't notice any effort. Altho some might equate working out with effort. I find I enjoy exercise, but on a certain level, it is effort. Effort would be having a goal and being motivated. Effortless would be following your calling without knowing and without having to know where it will lead you in the end. Depends on what you mean with that term. I find the concept of intentions very plausible. |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 5, 2013 5:21:33 GMT -8
I'm feeling a bit like a wild mustang at the moment reefy boy, and have you considered the possibility that I couldn't make a mistake if i tried? As long as 'mistake' is still crossing your mind, there's not only possibility for making a mistake but already some probability if you start paying attention to that thought. You're the one who said I made a mistake Reefs, so I dunno whose crossed mind you're talking about. There's some probability you're talking about yourself. |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 5, 2013 5:30:07 GMT -8
I don't notice any effort. Altho some might equate working out with effort. I find I enjoy exercise, but on a certain level, it is effort. Effort would be having a goal and being motivated. Effortless would be following your calling without knowing and without having to know where it will lead you in the end. Depends on what you mean with that term. I find the concept of intentions very plausible. I'm thinking about your distinction between effortless and effort. You seem to be saying that following your calling without having to know where it will lead you and having a goal that one is motivated toward don't fall under the same umbrella. I don't agree. I'm motivated to write a book. I have an idea of where my trajectory is going, but I certainly don't feel like I have to know. Maybe we could call it effortless effort  I also find the concept of intention plausible within certain contexts, just like the idea of a soul contract affecting conditioning or creating the potential for a split mind. |
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Post by Reefs on Feb 5, 2013 6:57:57 GMT -8
As long as 'mistake' is still crossing your ones mind, there's not only possibility for making a mistake but already some probability if you one starts paying attention to that thought.
You're the one who said I made a mistake Reefs, so I dunno whose crossed mind you're talking about. There's some probability you're talking about yourself.I was talking about a certain mindset in a general way. You can replace the 'you' with 'one' or 'someone' in what I said above if you don't like it. It wasn't about you, Jason, specifically. I'm not really interested the specifics of your or anyone's personal story. I'm more interested in the thought patterns and concepts behind it which correlate with those specifics. I was just teasing anyway. |
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Post by Reefs on Feb 5, 2013 7:10:02 GMT -8
I'm thinking about your distinction between effortless and effort. You seem to be saying that following your calling without having to know where it will lead you and having a goal that one is motivated toward don't fall under the same umbrella. I don't agree. I'm motivated to write a book. I have an idea of where my trajectory is going, but I certainly don't feel like I have to know. Maybe we could call it effortless effort Better not call it effortless effort. That way it will get too foggy and words will lose their meanings and we have to come up with a new meaningless meaning every month. Maybe your goal is just not very clear, that's all. Following your calling is kinda synonymous with 'flow experience'. It's very different from just being motivated. However, real life situations are very complex, so it could very well be that you are motivated to some degree and this motivation leads you to some kind of action/doing which is also part of your calling, so you will start out motivated and will have intervals of 'flow experience'. Soul contracts are a little too specific to be taken seriously. That's just my take. |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 5, 2013 12:38:41 GMT -8
You're the one who said I made a mistake Reefs, so I dunno whose crossed mind you're talking about. There's some probability you're talking about yourself.I was talking about a certain mindset in a general way. You can replace the 'you' with 'one' or 'someone' in what I said above if you don't like it. It wasn't about you, Jason, specifically. I'm not really interested the specifics of your or anyone's personal story. I'm more interested in the thought patterns and concepts behind it which correlate with those specifics. I was just teasing anyway. I'm saying I didn't think it was about me, I think was about you. |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 5, 2013 12:42:30 GMT -8
The only reason I called it effortless effort was because of your two definition reefs which created the apparent contradiction where there isn't any. Maybe your goal for writing these posts isn't very clear, and maybe its unconsciously motivated.
I won't share my experience with you since you said you weren't interested.
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Post by Reefs on Feb 6, 2013 8:04:04 GMT -8
The only reason I called it effortless effort was because of your two definition reefs which created the apparent contradiction where there isn't any. Maybe your goal for writing these posts isn't very clear, and maybe its unconsciously motivated. Maybe you didn't understand what I said. Well, you mentioned the idea of soul contracts. Didn't know you just wanted to share experiences. |
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Post by humphrey on Feb 6, 2013 8:41:09 GMT -8
jason, hats off to you for being so open on this. It's refreshing to see a spiritual teacher burning some extra calories and reporting on it. How did you figure you're ideal weight? Might you want to go with something a little more meaningful like bodyfat% and strength and endurance goals?
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Post by humphrey on Feb 6, 2013 9:25:53 GMT -8
"THere's really nothing to understand other than to see we're making it all up. WIth that said, the creation of concepts to probe the boundaries of belief is effective in creating the potential to transcend the boundary. When we notice a boundary being probed, we are given the opportunity to notice there's nothing there. Of course defense mechanisms may be in place which prevent that from happening. Hence, we sometimes discuss the dynamics of those mechanics, to make them conscious, and thus unable to function. In the absence of a self to defend, you aren't going to have much to worry about." I like that. It's consistent with what I'm understanding right now (which is probably why I like it and find some comfort reading it.) Contemplating 'we're just making it up' and 'Be still' and STFU...it's fun to see my little brain stammering away but...but.... I keep trying to put something coherent together to say after those buts. "There must be some exception I can state (cleverly)." On it goes. That seems to be modus operandi numero uno here in the hamlet of humphrey. One of the buts is about how that MO is annoying. |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 6, 2013 9:31:20 GMT -8
You seemed to take issue with my use of the term effortless effort. My whole entire prior post in which I used the term was an explanation of why the term is non sense, in case you missed that. Maybe you're ignoring what I'm saying, again. Did you miss the part where in this thread where I talked about losing 30 pounds? Whose experience am I sharing, the giraffe out back? But yes, I would like to keep the focus on becoming conscious. But its not like my understanding doesn't come from my experience, which as this thread would seem to imply, I am certainly willing to share. You like to see contradiction where there isn't any. Wonder why that is?  ? |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 6, 2013 9:42:31 GMT -8
"THere's really nothing to understand other than to see we're making it all up. WIth that said, the creation of concepts to probe the boundaries of belief is effective in creating the potential to transcend the boundary. When we notice a boundary being probed, we are given the opportunity to notice there's nothing there. Of course defense mechanisms may be in place which prevent that from happening. Hence, we sometimes discuss the dynamics of those mechanics, to make them conscious, and thus unable to function. In the absence of a self to defend, you aren't going to have much to worry about." I like that. It's consistent with what I'm understanding right now (which is probably why I like it and find some comfort reading it.) Contemplating 'we're just making it up' and 'Be still' and STFU...it's fun to see my little brain stammering away but...but.... I keep trying to put something coherent together to say after those buts. "There must be some exception I can state (cleverly)." On it goes. That seems to be modus operandi numero uno here in the hamlet of humphrey. One of the buts is about how that MO is annoying. Thanks humf I'm glad you're vibin and I appreciate the support. Well perhaps you're looking at a surface level mind split, that the 'but MO' is a program that shouldn't be operating. It's your MO, and they're your thoughts, so obviously there is an inclination to think them. Invite them and explore where they're going. When you see clearly they're going no where, you just might stumble onto the absence of them. I'm down to 187 and that was before I hit my morning workout. One thing I notice is that as I started losing weight, getting on the scale has become like a little carrot for me. I was driving into work this morning, and I hadn't eaten, and all I could think about was a steak egg and cheese burrito from Mickey D's, Have you had one of these yet? I'm doing Sunday snack day every sunday, which was a chicken parm sub for superbowl, I did broccoli pizza the week prior, and I'm seeing a Barnacle Bill's cheeseburger in the near future. But today, with the craving, I thought it through, I was like, do I really want this? After going running and being down 18 pounds? And that thought was empowering. Once you lose 10 pounds, that's a lot of weight. Think of how much a 10 pound bowling ball weighs. So I stopped at the Hess Station and got special k bar instead. Little ways to go but I'm more than half way there. WOOT WOOT!!! |
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Post by jasonlynch on Feb 6, 2013 10:49:13 GMT -8
jason, hats off to you for being so open on this. It's refreshing to see a spiritual teacher burning some extra calories and reporting on it. How did you figure you're ideal weight? Might you want to go with something a little more meaningful like bodyfat% and strength and endurance goals? Sorry humf, forgot about this one. I figured my ideal weight from my past experience. In my instance, this works, because I know at what weight i 'feel' the best, and I know what I'm capable of in terms of diet and exercise. The 'number' of the weight was just used to provide structure. This past week I spent most of my time lifting weights and loading up on protein, so yes I would say I care far more about bodyfat% strength and endurance. But I think its more relatable to people to do it in terms of weight. I imagine I will end up well under 10% body fat. In addition to this, every time I do a certain exercise, I'm always pushing that limit next time I hit it. So getting stronger, burning fat, increasing cardiovascular, these are all under the umbrella of the weight loss. In terms of my actual exercise regimen, it's not really that intense. I'll do 30 minutes on the treadmill 3-4 times a week and hit the weights 3-4 times a week for about 45 minutes. That works for me. For some people, you have to experiment, with not only regimen, but with diet also, to see what works, and what doesn't. We all have different body chemistries and unique capabilities. Becoming conscious of what they are allows us to use them to our advantage. Thanks for the support Humph. Give a status update in a few... |
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Post by enigma on Feb 6, 2013 12:01:23 GMT -8
You seemed to take issue with my use of the term effortless effort. My whole entire prior post in which I used the term was an explanation of why the term is non sense, in case you missed that. Maybe you're ignoring what I'm saying, again. I'm thinkin the issue here is about two different understandings of what constitutes effort. You talk about setting goals and planning exercise and diet regimens as effortless, and I can understand that you have vacated much or all of the sense of struggle involved, but there is a deeper level of effortlessness. To bridge these two understandings with the idea of effortless effort seems like a distraction. The reason i told my own weight loss story is specifically to point out this effortlessness that Reefs appears to be pointing to. There wasn't a weight loss goal as such, but there was an interest in understanding cravings. I don't mean to say there wasn't effort involved in this exploration, though i found it quite enjoyable. The effortlessness is specifically in the direct relationship between noticing and weight loss. Noticing what the craving was about led to an appropriate response to the craving rather than an inappropriate one, not because I wanted to be appropriate, or because I felt guilty, but simply because there's no room left for it to be other than what it is. No choices, no conflict, no effort to do the right thing or the best thing, but only the only thing. When the body needs food, the body is fed, and at no other time. The effort is always about a fabricated internal conflict which is still a mind split. There cannot be effortlessness in the presence of a mind split. |
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