|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 11, 2013 17:00:34 GMT -8
Roller coaster happiness is conditional, and you have to be moving to experience it, so when you are at the top you know where you are going next. There can be no Peace there. Peace and Love are unconditional. You cannot be robbed of your Peace because it's the ground that you stand on, the reference for all movement, the essence from which all feeling originates. Yes I do admit. But consider the situation in which is Love is expressed. Though you are LOVE, Love is not going to be expressed all the time right? It is expressed time to time. Whenever Love is expressed you feel joy. Now my question was, How do you differentiate this joy(Love is expressed) from the joy which you gain from Roller coaster positive side? You're talking about a joy that arises when certain conditions are met. It's the same dualistic conditional joy you've always experienced. Some will talk about a kind of unconditioned Love/Joy/Peace. Trying to differentiate between conditioned and unconditioned love and peace is hard enough, but unconditioned Joy takes us too far off track as folks immediately think of being permanently joyful. I think that's the general area where your question came from. I'd prefer to go the other direction and start breaking down the idea that Love is different from Peace. They are the same 'stateless state' of being. |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 11, 2013 21:22:11 GMT -8
Yes I do admit. But consider the situation in which is Love is expressed. Though you are LOVE, Love is not going to be expressed all the time right? It is expressed time to time. Whenever Love is expressed you feel joy. Now my question was, How do you differentiate this joy(Love is expressed) from the joy which you gain from Roller coaster positive side? You're talking about a joy that arises when certain conditions are met. It's the same dualistic conditional joy you've always experienced. Some will talk about a kind of unconditioned Love/Joy/Peace. Trying to differentiate between conditioned and unconditioned love and peace is hard enough, but unconditioned Joy takes us too far off track as folks immediately think of being permanently joyful. I think that's the general area where your question came from. I'd prefer to go the other direction and start breaking down the idea that Love is different from Peace. They are the same 'stateless state' of being. Are you coming to say the joy which derived from LOVE is too high? And what do you mean by stateless state? |
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 11, 2013 21:41:14 GMT -8
You're talking about a joy that arises when certain conditions are met. It's the same dualistic conditional joy you've always experienced. Some will talk about a kind of unconditioned Love/Joy/Peace. Trying to differentiate between conditioned and unconditioned love and peace is hard enough, but unconditioned Joy takes us too far off track as folks immediately think of being permanently joyful. I think that's the general area where your question came from. I'd prefer to go the other direction and start breaking down the idea that Love is different from Peace. They are the same 'stateless state' of being. Are you coming to say the joy which derived from LOVE is too high? And what do you mean by stateless state? No, I'm not saying that, Raj. What you've always known is a joy that comes at a price. I think what you want is to negotiate the price. What I'm saying is that joy is not what you need. We seek joy only to escape our sorrow, excitement to escape our boredom, freedom to escape the sense of imprisonment, power to escape the feeling of powerlessness. This is the roller coaster you say you want to get off of, but do you know where you are going when you get off? What if there is no sorrow, boredom, imprisonment or powerlessness? What if all of that is left behind on the roller coaster? What is life then? What it is not is you chasing after expressions of Love and a magical Joy. If you were born and raised in a prison, would you have any idea what freedom was? Would you long for freedom, or for a better prison? |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 11, 2013 22:10:48 GMT -8
Ok understood, are you saying Love is expressed when we are not seeking joy?
|
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 12, 2013 9:07:14 GMT -8
Ok understood, are you saying Love is expressed when we are not seeking joy? Love is what you are. You have to stop imagining that you are something else. |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 12, 2013 9:24:51 GMT -8
Enigma,
If so, what do you mean by "LOVE is expressed"? Isn't it the flow of feelings? Isn't it the experience of JOY?
|
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 12, 2013 20:16:05 GMT -8
Enigma, If so, what do you mean by "LOVE is expressed"? Isn't it the flow of feelings? Isn't it the experience of JOY? If your goal is joy, we should talk more about roller coasters. |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 12, 2013 21:41:09 GMT -8
Enigma, If so, what do you mean by "LOVE is expressed"? Isn't it the flow of feelings? Isn't it the experience of JOY? If your goal is joy, we should talk more about roller coasters. "As odd as it may sound, genuine Love is impersonal, meaning it does not favor your needs over that of your partner's. It does not recognize your fears, judgments, expectations, and so if you wish to experience Love flowing between you, you must get yourself out of the way and let it flow. Naturally, this is effortless and results in a happy relationship." what do you mean by "experience love flowing between you'? won't you get joy when this love flow between you and other person? |
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 13, 2013 7:45:49 GMT -8
If your goal is joy, we should talk more about roller coasters. "As odd as it may sound, genuine Love is impersonal, meaning it does not favor your needs over that of your partner's. It does not recognize your fears, judgments, expectations, and so if you wish to experience Love flowing between you, you must get yourself out of the way and let it flow. Naturally, this is effortless and results in a happy relationship." what do you mean by "experience love flowing between you'? won't you get joy when this love flow between you and other person? That joy cannot be your goal. |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 13, 2013 8:04:42 GMT -8
"That joy cannot be your goal"
Ok , I am trying to understand what you say. Are you coming to say that that(experience of LOVE) should not comes under need? And that joy expresses as it wishes?
Raj
|
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 13, 2013 20:08:36 GMT -8
"That joy cannot be your goal" Ok , I am trying to understand what you say. Are you coming to say that that(experience of LOVE) should not comes under need? And that joy expresses as it wishes? Raj I don't think so. I'm saying joy is not the goal. |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 13, 2013 20:26:38 GMT -8
Enigma,
If so, what do the say the name of the feelings when the love is expressed? wouldn't you feel joy when Love expressed? what is your feeling when love is expressed?Isn't it JOY?
Raj
|
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 15, 2013 15:08:39 GMT -8
Enigma, If so, what do the say the name of the feelings when the love is expressed? wouldn't you feel joy when Love expressed? what is your feeling when love is expressed?Isn't it JOY? Raj Joy is not the goal, Raj. This is a distraction. |
|
|
|
Post by Gopal on Feb 15, 2013 20:50:35 GMT -8
Joy is not the goal ,Yes I do admit the your point. But I am asking you ,what is your feeling when Love is expressed? Isn't it joy?
Raj
|
|
|
|
Post by enigma on Feb 15, 2013 22:07:54 GMT -8
Joy is not the goal ,Yes I do admit the your point. But I am asking you ,what is your feeling when Love is expressed? Isn't it joy? Raj Of course. |
|
