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Post by Reefs on Jan 16, 2013 17:41:47 GMT -8
Okay, I thought I'll continue the noodle-dialogs here. If one is comparing teachings and approaches, doing an imaginary dialog seems to be the best option in showing where different teachers differ, it also shows their different mental dispositions and personality which naturally flow into the teachings but get lost when only comparing the main message and core statements and concepts.
So, the question was how would different teachers approach one and the same question/statement of a seeker? The first statement was:
"I want to be healthy, wealthy and wise"
Everyone interested, try a fun dialog with your favorite teacher and see how they would approach the seeker's question. There's still a Niz dialog missing. I'll do that some time later. I'll also add a couple of other teachers later.
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Post by Reefs on Jan 16, 2013 17:47:31 GMT -8
First the Ramana-Noodle dialog:
Questioner: "I want to be healthy, wealthy and wise."
Ramana: "Who wants to be healthy, wealthy and wise?"
Questioner: "I just told you, I want it, silly."
Ramana: "Who is that 'I'?"
Questioner: "It's me. The one that is standing right in front of you."
Ramana: "That body?"
Questioner: "Well, a little more than just that body. There's also a brain and a mind."
Ramana: "The mind belongs to the body?"
Questioner: "Yup. It's inside the brain."
Ramana: "When you are asleep, are you still aware of your body?"
Questioner: "That body here? No."
Ramana: "When you are asleep, are you still aware of your desire to be healthy, wealthy and wise?"
Questioner: "Well, I don't know, depends whether I'm dreaming about it or not and if my brain is still working or not, I guess."
Ramana: "Do you have a body in your dreams?"
Questioner: "Sure."
Ramana: "Are you aware of that dream body right now?"
Questioner: "No. As soon as I wake up I forget what happened in my dreams."
Ramana: "Do you have desires in your dreams?"
Questioner: "Hm, I guess so, it feels pretty real, like when I'm being awake actually."
Ramana: "Are you aware of your dream desires right now?"
Questioner: "No. I forgot everything as soon as I woke up."
Ramana: "But it was you who had those desires in your dream."
Questioner: "Well, not really me. It was some kind of different me, actually. But still me somehow. Don't know if that makes sense..."
Ramana: "So in your dream state you can say 'I want this' and in your waking state you can also say 'I want this' and still the 'I' in the dream state is different from the 'I' in the waking state?"
Questioner: "Yeah, kinda weird, actually, if you put it that way."
Ramana: "Were you aware of this waking world in your dreams?"
Questioner: "No."
Ramana: "So where did the desire to be healthy, wealthy and wise go?"
Questioner: "I don't know. Just disappeared with this waking world somehow altogether."
Ramana: "But you were still there. There was still a sense of 'I' after the waking world disappeared and the dream world showed up?"
Question: "Well, yeah, the dream 'I' which is kinda different in some way."
Ramana: "How different?"
Question: "It's different, I mean, I'm in different places, a different world, I do different things and ..."
Ramana: "But it still feels like you?"
Questioner: "Yes. It's me. But when I compare it with the waking state me it's different although both feel like really me myself. Strange conversation, eh."
Ramana: "So when the waking world disappears you are still there, somehow. And when the dream world disappears you are also still there, somehow. So, are you always there?"
Questioner: "Yeah, kinda, sorta. At least the sense of 'I' is there, although I have different characteristics and do different things and such."
Ramana: "So you are always there, but the waking world and the dream world do come and go. What does that mean. Does that place you in the world or the world in you?"
Questioner: "Hm. Looks like I'm just watching it come and go. So, no, I'm not really in the world."
Ramana: "So you do have different bodies in both waking world and dream world and they both feel real. And although you have different characteristics and attributes in dream state and waking state, there still is this unbroken sense of 'I', of you being you yourself."
Questioner: "Yes."
Ramana: "Where does your dream world appear?"
Questioner: "In my mind. It's all just in the mind, it's just a dream, ye know."
Ramana: "And when you are dreaming, doesn't your waking world seem like a dream too?"
Question: "Hmm. Maybe."
Ramana: "Are you dreaming right now or are you awake? Can you tell?"
Question: "It always feels like awake."
Ramana: "You can't tell the difference?"
Questioner: "No. Not really. I only know that I dreamed after I wake up."
Ramana: "So the dream world is only in the mind. You can't tell if you are dreaming or awake. They feel the same. So, is the waking world also only in the mind?"
Questioner: "Probably. Yeah, looks like it is all just in the mind."
Ramana: "So, is the mind in the body or the body in the mind?"
Questioner: "The body is in the mind."
Ramana: "Then the brain is also in the mind?"
Questioner: "Yup."
Ramana: "And your desires?"
Questioner: "Also in the mind"
Ramana: "Have you control over your dream desires in your waking state? Are they still there? Are they still your desires?"
Questioner: "No."
Ramana: "Have you control over your waking state desires in your dream state? Are they still there? Are they still your desires?"
Questioner: "No."
Ramana: "So they are not always there. They are not always your desires. Are they your desires at all?"
Questioner: "Well, as you say, they come and go and I have no control over the coming and going so I guess, no. They are not really my desires. But at least it looks like they are my desires for a while."
Ramana: "They only appear to be your desires? Like the bodies with brains appear to be your bodies?"
Questioner: "Exactly."
Ramana: "And the different you with all the different attributes also only appear to be you?"
Questioner: "Yeah. At least the different 'I' with attributes, the real sense of I that seems to be unbroken seems to be really real. Ye know what I'm saying?"
Ramana: "If desires are in the mind only then let the mind take care of them. Let the dream mind take care of the dream desires and let the waking mind take care of the waking desires."
Questioner: "Cool."
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Post by Reefs on Jan 16, 2013 17:48:25 GMT -8
Okay, now the Abraham-Noodle dialog:
Abraham: "Good morning."
Questioner: "Good morning."
Abraham: "We are extremely pleased that you are here. It is good to come together for the purpose of co-creating. Do you agree?"
Questioner: "Yes."
Abraham: "Do you know what you are wanting?"
Questioner: "Yes."
Abraham: "Hmmmm, it moves about a bit, doesn't it?"
Questioner: "Yes."
Abraham: "Do you enjoy the contrast of your time and place?"
Questioner: "Yes."
Abraham: "Liar, liar pants on fire!"
Questioner: "Hahaha."
Abraham: "Just kiddin'. Now, what it is that you are wanting?"
Questioner: "I want to be healthy wealthy and wise"
Abraham: "Then get into the vortex! Next question."
Questioner: "Oh?!"
Abraham: "Well, we are just playing with you a bit here. But it really is just that simple. You are source energy. Healthy, wealthy and wise is your birth right, your natural state of being."
Question: "But I'm not healthy, I'm not wealthy, in fact I'm in debt, debt = deep dudu, ye know, and since I don't see a way out of this mess I'm also not feeling very wise."
Abraham: "Look at what you just said. Look at your negative drum beating."
Questioner: "I'm actually a very positive person. I can tell a lot of jokes and I also am very nice and..."
Abraham: "Blah blah blah blah blah. Your words are not important. Your vibration is important, the signal you are sending out to the boundaries of the universe. That's what Law of attraction is picking up. And you know how you know what you have been sending out?"
Questioner: "By the way I feel?"
Abraham: "Well, that's how you know what you are sending out right now. But you know what you have been sending out when you look at what's manifesting around you. So, what's manifesting around you?"
Question: "A total mess."
Abraham: "Then you must be sending out a total mess."
Questioner: "Hmm. Right. How can I fix that?"
Abraham: "By focusing more deliberately. By not scattering yourself all over the place. By taking charge, by stopping to be a mere reactionary to circumstances and events."
Questioner: "How can I become a visionary?"
Abraham: "By letting go of your old actionary habits of trying to orchestrate everything and beating everyone and everything into submission, by letting go of the silly habit of having to wrestle every problem to the ground. And instead just focus on your vision and only act when you are inspired."
Questioner: "Cool."
Abraham: "So, healthy, wealthy and wise is your vision?"
Questioner: "Well, that would be nice, but actually I love to cook Italian food."
Abraham: "Then do only what you love, make lists of positive aspects of everyone and everything in your life, count your blessings and get as much as possible into the vortex, play more, laugh more, have fun, relax more, don't make such a big hairy deal out of everything. And we promise you that healthy, wealthy and wise will take care of itself if you would just chill out."
Questioner: "Thank you. Can I give you a hug?"
Abraham: "From the inside out."
Questioner: "Okay."
Abraham: "All is well. We are complete."
Esther: "Wow, that was exciting! Yahoooo!!! Bye everyone, see you on the next cruise."
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Post by spongey on Jan 18, 2013 4:26:30 GMT -8
What I'm getting here is 'surrender'.
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Post by Reefs on Jan 19, 2013 2:48:41 GMT -8
What I'm getting here is 'chill out'! ;D
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Post by spongey on Jan 19, 2013 4:42:40 GMT -8
What I'm getting here is 'chill out'! ;D "same same but different" |
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Post by Reefs on Jan 20, 2013 18:09:55 GMT -8
"same same but different"There is a difference! |
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